NOVEMBER 10, 2003


The Honorable Council of the City of Evansville met on regular session at 6:30 pm on Monday, November 10, 2003 in the City Council Chambers, Room 301 Civic Center Complex, Evansville, Indiana with President John, presiding.  The following business was conducted.


These minutes are not intended to be a verbatim transcript.  Audiotapes of this meeting are on file in the City Clerk’s Office.



Present:            Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:            Robinson


There being eight (8) members present and one (1) member absent and eight (8) members representing a quorum, the President declared this session of the Common Council officially opened.



Joey Kiefer (son of Councilman Joe Kiefer) led the pledge of allegiance this evening.



John Hamilton is Council Attorney this evening.



President John: Are there any students in the audience who would like to be recognized this evening?  So that you go in the  record and if you need it for school you’ll have it.  Would you please stand up and state your name.


Joe Blubaugh, Reitz Memorial High School.


President John: Your friends happen to also be Memorial students?


Blubaugh: Yes.


President John: Would you state your names.


Caitlin Ehrmann, Jenna Burgess, Andrea Zirkelbach.


President John:  Welcome to the meeting. 



Jessalyn Julian                                                   Jason Nix

Joey Kiefer                                                       Allie Merkley

Vikram Goyal                                                  



Is there a motion to approve the minutes of the October 27, 2003 meetings of the Common Council as written?


Councilman Bagbey moved and Councilman Kiefer seconded the motion that the minutes of the regular meeting of the Common Council held October 27, 2003 be approved as written.  Voice vote.  So ordered.




*Minutes from City Council Meeting held October 27, 2003.

*Ordinance F-2003-20.

*Resolution C-2003-27.

*Draft Consolidated Housing & Community Development 2004 Annual Action


*October Sales Report to Evansville Convention & Visitors Bureau Board of


*A News Release regarding New Soccer Complex Name.

*A letter from Myrrl L. Choate, Executive Director of Meals on Wheels.

*Evansville Redevelopment Commission Draft Agenda for November 5, 2003 meeting.

*A News Release regarding Honor Award for Downtown Design Guidelines.

*A Schedule of meetings for the month of November in the City/County Administration Building.



*A Memo from EUTS Director Rose Zigenfus regarding the 2030 Transportation Plan.

*Board of Park Commissioners Agenda for November 5, 2003 meeting.

*A letter from Catherine Fanello and Mayor Russell Lloyd, Jr. regarding upcoming

  Comprehensive Technology Master Plan.

*911 Ambulance Call Summary for September 2003.

*A memo from Janet McCabe, Assistant Commissioner of IDEM, regarding Fine Particle Matter Standard.



*Inter-department vacation studies and return receipt cards for G-2003-27.

*A Notice of Claim against the City of Evansville.

*Agenda for Board of Zoning Appeals November 20, 2003 Public Hearing.

*Board of Zoning Appeals Notice to the City of Evansville as abutting property to EVSC.


Councilman Melcher moved and Councilman Angermeier seconded the motion to receive, file and make these reports and communications a part of the minutes of the meeting.  Voice vote.  So ordered.




ORDINANCE F-2003-20     FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                         JOHN            



RESOLUTION C-2003-27               FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                JOHN    



Councilman Melcher moved and Councilwoman Walden seconded the motion to adopt the Consent Agenda as written.  Voice vote.  So ordered.


President John:  As I mentioned during the Finance Committee meeting we have an Ordinance in front of us….a Resolution in front of us this evening that needs the suspension of our rules.  So at this time I’d like a motion to suspend the rules to hear Resolution C-2003-27 on second and third reading, and this has to be unanimous.


Councilman Bagbey moved and Councilwoman Walden seconded the motion to suspend the rules and hear Resolution C-2003-27 and move to second and third readings.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:             Robinson.        


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Resolution C-2003-27 is hereby moved to second and third readings.




RESOLUTION C-2003-27               FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                JOHN    



President John:  At this time we’ll have discussion on this particular Resolution.  We have a representative from DMD here to inform us of what action is needed this evening.


Joe Coleman: Good evening Councilmen, Councilwomen, Joe Coleman with the Department.  This annual action plan for 2004 is the result of the year long process which members here and the Council themselves participated in the budgetary hearings earlier this year.  And this is annually submitted to HUD.  It is a report on what we plan to do next year.  And, we as part of our Citizens Participation Agreement, and our plan, we ask the City Council annually to pass a Resolution approving the draft plan and making it our plan for 2004.  Thank you.


President John: Are there any questions by Members of Council regarding the plan or what we are doing this evening?  If not, is there a motion to move Resolutions C-2003-27 to third


reading?  Before we bring this to a vote is there anyone in the audience that would like to speak either in favor of or in opposition to this Resolution and the action plan as submitted?


Councilman Watts moved and Councilman Angermeier seconded the motion to move Resolution C-2003-27 to third reading and at this time I’ll call roll.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:            Robinson.


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Resolution C-2003-27 is hereby moved to third reading.  So we vote one more time on this particular Resolution.




ORDINANCE G-2003-27         PUBLIC WORKS                                                    BAGBEY            



ORDINANCE F-2003-19          FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                           JOHN            



RESOLUTION C-2003-25         PUBLIC WORKS                                                    BAGBEY    



RESOLUTION C-2003-26         ASD (ANGERMEIER)                                            MELCHER    





PUBLIC WORKS CHAIRMAN_________________________________________ BAGBEY

G-2003-27 was held until next Monday at 6:00 p.m.  And Mr. Fuchs I know you are here for that.


Mr. Fuchs:  Your right about that.


Councilman Bagbey:  And that will be held until next Monday at 6:00.


President John:  We had a Committee hearing on it. Some residents were here. The officers were here.  They are having some meeting with the discussion on the vacation so you may want to contact either the neighbors or the FOP and involve yourself in those discussions. 


Mr. Fuchs:  I think I’d like to talk to the FOP.  Thank you.


Councilman Bagbey:  Resolution C-2003-25 we have a do-pass recommendation.


FINANCE CHAIRWOMAN__________________________________________ROBINSON

President John: In Councilwoman Robinson’s absence I have handled the Finance Committee meeting and Ordinance F-2003-19 comes forward with a do-pass recommendation.


ASD CHAIRMAN________________________________________________ANGERMEIER

We had a Committee meeting earlier on C-2003-26 and we have a do-pass recommendation.


Councilman Melcher moved and Councilman Watts seconded the motion to adopt the committee Reports and move these Ordinances and Resolutions to Third Reading.  Voice vote.  So ordered.


There being no further motions, these Ordinances and Resolutions are hereby moved to Third Reading.




ORDINANCE F-2003-19                FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                           JOHN            



Councilwoman Walden moved and Councilman Kniese seconded the motion to adopt

Ordinance F-2003-19 and call the roll.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John

Absent:            Robinson.


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Ordinance F-2003-19 is hereby declared ADOPTED.




RESOLUTION C-2003-25               PUBLIC WORKS                                                BAGBEY    



Councilwoman Walden moved and Councilman Bagbey seconded the motion to adopt

Resolutions C-2003-25 and call the roll.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:             Robinson


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Resolution C-2003-25 is hereby declared ADOPTED.




RESOLUTION C-2003-26               ASD (ANGERMEIER)                                MELCHER    



Councilman Melcher moved and Councilman Bagbey seconded the motion to adopt

Resolutions C-2003-26 and call the roll.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:            Robinson       


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Resolution C-2003-26 is hereby declared ADOPTED.




RESOLUTION C-2003-27               FINANCE (ROBINSON)                                                JOHN    



Councilwoman Walden moved and Councilman Kiefer seconded the motion to adopt

Resolution C-2003-27 and call the roll.



Ayes:                Kniese, Bagbey, Melcher, Koehler Walden, Watts, Angermeier, Kiefer, John.

Absent:             Robinson.        


There being eight (8) ayes and zero (0) nays, Resolution C-2003-27 is hereby declared ADOPTED.



President John:  Rose.


Rose Zigenfus:  Good evening Council Members, I’m Rose Zigenfus and that’s spelled Z-I-G-E-N-F-U-S.  We are here tonight to present the 2030 Transportation Plan.  We’ve handed out a copy of the map, the list of projects.  We are in our public comment period, which is already underway.  We’re presenting to all the elected body’s within our jurisdictions which include the City, the County, Warrick County, Henderson, Posey, and Gibson County.  Our 2030 plan must be fiscally constrained, which means we can’t spend more money than we think we are going to get.  We also have a Vision section of the plan for those projects that we can’t fund immediately or show that we have funding for.  And our plan also must meet air quality standards.  We have an admissions budget and through the modeling process we must be able to show, demonstrate that we are within the budget.  Our plan is on the web, our web site, which is  It’s available in our office and you have it on your desks.  So I’m going to introduce Pamela


Drach. She’s going to go over the projects with you.  If there are any questions now or later, don’t hesitate to ask.  Thank you.


Pamela Drach:  Good evening, I’m Pamela Drach with EUTS.  And I’ll start with the top page, not including your map. The top page of the list of projects, the title being “Projects to be completed by the year 2006”.  These are projects that need to be constructed and open to traffic by January 1 of 2006, and this date is chosen as part of the air quality conformity process. 


Councilman Melcher:  As we get started would it be partly easier on…if anyone’s got a question jump out at that time?  Instead of trying to wait until you get to the end because you probably won’t remember.


Pamela Drach: What I’ll do is I’ll go over the City of Evansville projects with you, but if you have any questions about any of the other projects, I’ll be happy to answer those as well.  Starting off with the first project for the City is the Maxx Road Project.  It goes from Lynch Road, or extends to Maxx Road Project from where it terminates currently south of Lynch Road down to Oak Hill Road.  And then the next two projects are the St. Joe Projects, they will extend through the improvements on St. Joe Avenue from where the intersection project leaves off at Illinois on up to Diamond Avenue.  The St. Joe projects are currently in right-of-way acquisition and the next phase for that would be to finalize the plans and move to construction. 


Councilman Melcher: These plans are for 2006.


Councilwoman Walden:  On the Lynch Road, Oak Hill Road, Maxx Road section...give a little bit more background on that if you would please.


Pamela Drach: Certainly.  The Transportation Plan network that we show, it demonstrates that there is a need for that connection between Lynch Road and Oak Hill Road, that extension of Maxx Road to help alleviate some congestion problems at the Lynch Road/Oak Hill Road intersection and to provide another way for traffic that’s going to the development along Maxx Road to get to that facility as opposed to just having to take Lynch Road.  A developer came through and proposed and made a development plan for an apartment complex at Oak Hill….on Oak Hill where the Maxx Road extension would come through.  He’s dedicated the right of way and has made an agreement to build the bed for the road and that the City….the only thing the City needs to do is come through and pave that.


Councilwoman Walden:  How does EUTS become involved with this project then?  My understanding was that it was a City project and that we, if I remember right, we did not pass the funding for this.


Councilman Melcher: We passed the funding, and we took it away, but it’s in the budget for next year.  And I said the first Finance Ordinance next year, we’re going to look at taking it away again.


Councilwoman Walden: That’s…that’s what I…..


Councilman Melcher: But EUTS has to be involved with all these projects because they tie into other roads, which brings down the Federal funds, so if they are not involved in it, it doesn’t happen.  Joe sits on the EUTS with me as the Mayor’s representative when the Mayor is not there.  But we took the… know it’s on their priority, but some of us would like to see, you know, maybe another bridge, or maybe that coming out and going down Maxx Road.  You know, instead of going over to Oak Hill.  So that’s something that’s in discussions.  It was taken out two years ago.  The Mayor put it back in the budget.  We didn’t take it out because at the time we were thinking about taking it out, the budget was already full.  Then we decided not to bother the budget if you remember.  So we just said the first of the year we’ll look at moving that money out of that project.  Our local money.


Councilwoman Walden: Yeah, I’d be in favor of looking at other options.  I know the Neighborhood Association I see some representatives here tonight.  And some of the neighbors over there have expressed to me that they are not in favor of this project.  So, tonight are you asking us for approval on this, or are you just presenting it?


Pamela Drach: Presenting it and open for comments.


Councilwoman Walden: Okay.  Well my comment would be I’d like for us to look for some other alternatives other than this extension here.


Councilman Kiefer: Are there….have you done all the public meetings, are they complete now, or are there anymore public meetings remaining?


Pamela Drach: Yes, we have several more.  We are going to Henderson yet. We have Warrick County to present, Vanderburgh.…I think we’ve finished Vanderburgh County.  Yeah, we have several more to go.


Councilman Kiefer: But the ones here on this page for 2006 under the City of Evansville the public meetings are finished, is that what you’re stating?


Pamela Drach: Well no, we will also be discussing these at our Policy and Technical Committee meetings this Thursday at which is open to public as well.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay, thank you.


Pamela Drach: Are there any other questions about the 2006 projects?  Okay then, moving on to the 2015 projects.  These are projects to be completed and open to traffic by January 1 of 2015.  It doesn’t mean that the project won’t be constructed until 2015 it can happen sometime before that it just needs to be completed by 2015.  So it could happen in 2009, 10, 12, you know, somewhere before 2015.  The first project on the list is a Burkhardt Road widening.  It’s widened to five lanes. That’s with a continuous left turn lane in the center from Lincoln Avenue to the Lloyd Expressway.


Councilman Kniese:  Question.  Obviously I’ve had a couple of calls on that since the study just came out, and the study actually goes all the way out to Washington Avenue.  With… I don’t think there’s going to be any change proposed for Newburgh Road to Washington.  It’s two-lane right now.  The section of greater concern I think is between Outer Lincoln and Newburgh Road on Burkhardt.  And I know to put a middle lane, if you will, turn lane…turn that into a three-lane drive.  I looked at the study…help me understand, would it be to the east side of the existing road

where most of the land would be taken, or is it equally divided between the west and east side of Burkhardt?  Do you remember?


Pamela Drach: I’m not sure.  And I’m not sure that they spell that out specifically in that project or not.  A lot of times those issues are addressed as the project starts into design.


Councilman Kniese: Okay.  That’s the concern that I’ve discussed with some of the neighbors, and I told them it’s very early in the design right now.  But, if you wouldn’t mind, if you could put me on your list as far as that particular project, if there’s any meetings that I could put together with some of the concerned neighbors, I would like to be invited to those.  And I just want to make sure that everybody is up to date on what is being proposed for that area.


Pamela Drach: Okay, certainly, no problem. 


Councilman Kniese: Thank you very much.


Pamela Drach: The next project on the list is Oak Hill Road Project.  There’s an environmental document that’s been approved for this project and preliminary studies have been completed.  It’s to upgrade the section from US 41 to Weinbach Avenue and to widen to three lanes from Weinbach to Lynch Road. 


Clerk Matlock: Can I ask a question on that, I live on that road?  Okay, I live right across the street from the cemetery.  The brick wall, you know, they are just going to throw me over there.  The thing is, you’re talking about widening it how wide?


Pamela Drach: That section is just a reconstruction, it’s still going to be a two-lane section.  They are adding sidewalks and curb and gutter to help with the drainage problem.


Clerk Matlock: Well, we…we have sidewalks, they are all broken up and we have ditches.  So they are going to improve all that? 


Pamela Drach: Correct.


Clerk Matlock: They are going to put new road and improve it and fix the sidewalk.  You’re not going to take any of my yard?


Pamela Drach: I don’t know.  I’d have to look specifically at the plans themselves.  It’s my understanding that all the improvements are being done with an existing right-of-way.


Clerk Matlock: All right, that’s cool.


Councilman Bagbey: But half of your yard is a right-of-way. (laughter)


Pamela Drach: We have copies of the report in our office.


Clerk Matlock: That’s all right.


 Pamela Drach: The next project on the list would be the State and Federally funded project.  The Lloyd Expressway a new interchange construction of Fulton Avenue and First Avenue.  The next project would be at Lloyd Expressway from Barker/St. Joe, similar situation, and we want interchanges at those locations and those two intersections have to be coordinated. 


Councilman Kiefer: How’s it going with right-of- way acquisition?  Are they doing some of that now?


Pamela Brach: I believe they have done some early acquisitions at the St. Joe intersection and there have been some discussions at Fulton Avenue.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay good, I’m very happy to see that in there.  Thank you.


Pamela Drach: And then the final project for the 2015 list is the interchange modification at US 41 and Lloyd Expressway.  Any other questions about those?  Okay, moving on to the 2025.  A new project to the program would be an improvement or a reconstruction to Claremont Avenue from Red Bank to Barker.  And then improvements on Red Bank Road from Broadway to Upper Mount Vernon Road.  Because of the commercial and residential development on the West Side, these corridors are showing a need for improvement in that area.  And done in conjunction with the improvements that the State is making on the Lloyd Expressway, we feel that these projects will help to serve that area much better.  Then the final project for the 2025 list is a US 41 widening six lanes from I-164 to Virginia.  Any questions about these?  Moving on to the 2030 there’s one project proposed, this is just a five year time period, which is why the list of projects in this section is shorter.  And this project is to do improvements to Broadway from Felstead to Barker. 


Councilman Watts: Broadway was on this year’s list.  Do you have any idea why the back up allowed the removal as far as it getting done?  It’s my understanding that this was supposed to be at least repaved on….in 2003.


Pamela Drach: Oh, the repaving and maintenance  would be for the City Engineer’s Department.  What we are proposing is actual reconstruction and some improvements on there. 


President John: Are there any questions for Pam?


Pamela Drach: Also in your packet are a list of Vision projects as Rose mentioned.  Our plan has to be fiscally constrained, but obviously the needs for our area outnumber the amount of money that we are getting.  So we’ve put together a list of Vision projects.  These are projects that should funding become available, we can move from the Vision section into the physically constrained list. 


Councilman Kiefer: I have a question.  Obviously the big concern for a lot of folks is that west side loop, you know, I know that you’ve heard a lot of politicians probably talking about that as well as the Chamber and citizens and everybody else.  What would it take…I mean is this something where the State and Federal Government would then have to come up with a bunch of money?  I mean obviously I know that’s a very, very expensive project, but I mean what are you talking about that….what it would take to move it from Vision plan to reality?


Pamela Drach: It would be funding, and…..


Councilman Kiefer: I know, but what I’m asking is you’re talking….do you have some rough ideas on total…..


Pamela Drach: The amount of cost?


Councilman Kiefer: Right.


Pamela Drach: 1.2 billion.


Councilman Kiefer: 1.2 billion.  So that would take Federal funding obviously.


Pamela Drach: Right.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay, is there any conversations with anybody from the Federal Government about that, or…I mean, do you know of any conversations going on with that?


Pamela Drach: No, not that I’m aware of.  There are some….I think the Chamber and probably some Council Members that are very interested in that project and they may have initiated some discussions. 


Councilman Kiefer: Okay, I think Rose probably has a comment.


Councilman Melcher: The last EUTS meeting some of us were still pushing the west side loop and making sure it got into the Vision part of it even though it didn’t get into the other because of the funding.  But I think Rose is putting together a financial package because I want to see what the difference is.  And I think it’s like seventy million different.  But aren’t we putting some kind of financial…..


Rose Zigenfus: We’re looking at the cost figures for each alternative.  And let me just say I-69 corridor selection process has not been completed.  They have not determined whether or not the West Side is eliminated, so just keep that in mind.  Currently we are looking at the east side only because a new bridge was in our plan back in 2000 and back in 1997 as well.  And for purposes of getting a plan completed, we left it on the east side.  But the I-69 decision has yet to be made, and that will be made sometime in January. 


Councilman Kiefer: In January 04. 


Rose Zigenfus: 04, right.


Councilman Melcher: But also the model showed that there were more cars on the east side because of the shopping and everything today.  The west side showed less cars because it’s still a lot of fields in that one.  And they try to take in, at least I believe you try to take in the Port Authority and everything, and what we thought.  We still don’t know if…I don’t think it’s accurate, but the model is a model and that’s what we have to go by.  But some of us still want the west side loop.


Councilman Kiefer: Steve I’d like to commend you because I’ve heard a lot of positive comments about your efforts on that and much appreciate it.


Councilman Melcher: Thanks.


President John: Councilwoman.


Councilwoman Walden: Thank you.  Question on the Vision of Stringtown Road reconstruction from Maxwell to Petersburg Road.  Would that involve a widening, or are we just talking improvements?


Pamela Drach: Just improvements.  Maybe turn lanes at intersections where needed.  Maybe improvements on safety, maybe there are some site distance issues those types of things.


Councilwoman Walden: Okay.  And again this is the Vision and depending upon funding, so we are very preliminary on this. 


Pamela Drach: Correct.


Councilwoman Walden: Great, thank you.


Councilman Bagbey: What does the acronym TIP mean as far as funding source again?


Pamela Drach: TIP stands for the Transportation Improvement Program, the document we put in every year.  It has three (3) years of funding shown in it.  It shows how the Federal funding that’s coming into our area for that three -year time period is being spent.  And when I have TIP in the funding source column that indicates that it’s a project that we’ve estimated that can be used….can use Federal funding.  So it would be eighty percent (80%) Federally funded and twenty percent 20% local. 


Councilman Melcher: And a lot of times that’s what we are passing is the State….is the State highway or State…they will say add this to your TIP fund so we can get this funded and moved on. 


Councilman Bagbey: Appreciate it.


Councilman Kiefer: Thank you.  In regards to Columbia Street this is V-6 under Vanderburgh County, extension of Columbia Street from Burkhardt to County Line.  Do you know, what is going on with that?  At least Columbia Street….I mean even though this may not be a part of this specifically but it’s related.  Is Columbia Street going to be extended from Burkhardt to Cross Pointe or what’s…what’s in the plan there?


Pamela Drach: We have in our office a network that’s been proposed for that area.  It was developed in conjunction with Area Plan Commission and the Vanderburgh County Engineer, and the City Engineer, of what we’d like to see happen in that area.  The roads would be constructed as development takes place.  So as development continues out there we will pull out this plan and ask the developers to extend Columbia on over to Cross Pointe at a minimum we’d like to take over.


Councilman Kiefer: Right, because I know that they have built the apartments there and they have a lot of other development.  I was just curious, you know, if there’s been any success.  I understood that there was some hold up from some of the families that own some of that land back there on getting, you know, whatever you needed, you know, contracts, or easements, or something so…...


Pamela Drach: Warrick County will take it then from the County line over to Epworth and the Warrick County Commissioners are very much interested in getting this other east/west connector from Warrick County over into Vanderburgh County.


Councilman Kiefer: Just like these other projects, if it’s in the Vision, there’s a possibility that something like that could be bumped into the TIP plan then?


Pamela Drach: That’s correct.  Or it could be funded 100% local funds like the developers could put it in as they go along. 


Councilman Kiefer: Okay, thank you. 


Pamela Drach: Sure.


Councilman Melcher: Joe if you remember this area that area is all TIPed by the County, so that’s why it has to be done by the developers now, because there isn’t any new money there.  All that property taxes go into TIF fund.


Councilman Kiefer: Do you recall how long that TIF is….


Councilman Melcher: That was about a fifteen (15) year project so it’s probably got eight or nine  years left.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay.  Thanks.


Councilman Melcher: And one thing you probably should say Pam, is tell them basically these priorities, some things could get moved up.  I mean they are not necessarily in the order.


Pamela Drach: No, they are not in any priority order at all.  They are mostly alphabetical and local projects vs. State projects.


Councilman Melcher: That’s what I was saying, if we want to pull some money from one and put it in another that would move that one forward. 


President John: Any other questions by Members of Council at this time?  Pam do you have anything else you would like to add or Rose?


Councilman Kiefer: I have one question.


President John: Councilman.


Councilman Kiefer: Can you give an update on the progress on the Lloyd Expressway at Green River Road?  Are they on schedule?  Will they be finishing as planned or are they ahead of schedule or behind?  I mean what’s going on there?


Pamela Drach: I don’t know that, but I can find that out for you and get back with you on that.


Councilman Kiefer: Yeah, I’d like to know that if you don’t mind maybe you can just e-mail me a response to that.  Thanks.


Pamela Drach: Okay, and thanks.


Councilman Kiefer: Going to be out of town, but I’ll be here for the vote on….in December.  I’d like for the City Council to appoint me next year if you guys would be nice enough to do that. 


President John: Moving on the next order of business (laughter). 


Councilman Melcher: (Inaudible).


Councilman Kiefer: I don’t think I’m heading in that direction.


President John: Is there any other matter at this point by other Members of Council that they would like to bring up.  Councilman.


Councilman Kniese: It’s more of a comment than anything else.  I was downtown and happened to….right behind the Pagoda where they have started to finish part of the Greenway Project, and I was curious if anybody had any discussion with the Greenway Committee about the possibility of adding some emergency phones along the way similar to what they have on the University campuses.  I’ve not contacted that group yet, but I have no idea what costs would be involved but I thought maybe I would get hold of that group just to see if it made sense throughout the whole Greenway Project to possibly have a few emergency phones put along the way.  I don’t know who on this Council has been really close to that project.  If there is anybody please, I’d like to get with you just to have a discussion.


President John: We do have an appointment.  Maybe you’d like that.  Good we’ll discuss that.


Councilman Kniese: Okay, thank you.


President John: Councilman.


Councilman Kniese: I’d like to ask Rose Zigenfus a question before she leaves.  Rose during the campaign an issue came up regarding US 41 and Washington Avenue and Bosse High School and the students.  I kind of remember we’ve had conversations about this in the past.  Could you refresh Council’s memory on why that hasn’t been proposed, or hasn’t anything like that hadn’t been moved ahead on?


Rose Zigenfus: Sure.


President John: I think he’s talking about an overpass for the students.


Rose Zigenfus: The pedestrian overpass for the students. 


Councilman Melcher: You know that one right?


Rose Zigenfus: I know that one a little bit.


Councilman Melcher: That was another one of mine.


Rose Zigenfus: There are certain criteria that need to be met in order for a pedestrian overpass to be constructed over a State Highway.  One of those is number of people that might use it.  The second is the criteria stipulates that it cannot be within three hundred feet (300’) of a signalized or an intersection…major intersection.  So there were two factors then working against that.  There weren’t enough pedestrians wanting to use it, and if you put it three-hundred feet (300’) north or south of the intersection, it doesn’t serve the students purpose of getting them across, because they are not going to walk a block to climb up an overpass and then over into Bosse Field.  Or it’s Enlow Field.


Councilman Kiefer: Are there any other safety measures that can be put in place at such time that they cross or heavily use that, maybe a longer crosswalk signal for them to get across, or I mean, is there some other kind of mechanism, or can we at least look at that to see if there is some other safety precaution besides the overpass that might help those students?


Rose Zigenfus: I think, I think they are doing that.  I’ve gotten several calls from Randy Heidorn with the School Corporation and they were looking at a pedestrian signal that counted down the number of seconds that were left in the cycle for them to make it safely across the road.  So I think that they are looking at those kinds of things.


Councilman Kiefer: Oh, so there is a possibility for that to come about then?


Rose Zigenfus: Yeah.


Councilman Kiefer: Could you, I mean, do I need to have them report back to us, or will you report back to us on the success or failure of that?


Rose Zigenfus: I can do it.  I’ll check with Randy and see what’s going on and let you know.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay, thanks.


Rose Zigenfus: Okay.


Councilman Bagbey: As a member of the School Safety Commission, which is established by a new State law, Mr. Kiefer, we have been looking into that and Randy Heidorn has been charged with the responsibility.  There were all kinds of suggestions from cooperation with Indiana State Police, INDOT, Department of Transportation using flashing lights to grant to use off duty, or current on duty Indiana State Troopers, Vanderburgh County Sheriff, EPD.  There have been a whole lot of things have been thrown out.  The flashing lights were discussed with using computerization and giving you a countdown.  One of the things that we are concerned, is that with the absence of a walking…or an overpass, which is now completely off the table, it would


be the allocation of people power to adequately stop that traffic.  And that’s about the only way we are going to be able to do it.  We’ve done buses and the young folks refuse to ride the buses.  But right now that’s what Randy has been given the charge by the School Safety Commission to come in with different types of concepts.  And one of the things we had in our meeting was for him to interact with Ms. Zigenfus. 


President John: Councilman.


Councilman Melcher: We’ve been trying to get this overpass for what ten, twelve years?


Rose Zigenfus: A long time.


Councilman Melcher: We even had the land donated when that Doctor owned that land that McDonald’s is sitting on.  We couldn’t get it done then.  I argued at that time that Harrison had one just so the children could go to lunch.  Yet we couldn’t have one so Bosse kids could go to school.  And then when Preservation Park started in the State Hospital, and Rose can testify to this, they are talking about putting up a (INAUDIBLE) and thing back across the Lloyd there.  And I’m saying: “how can we get one there for occasional use when we can’t get one for our students”.  So that’s been a big issue for a long time at Bosse High School.


Rose Zigenfus: There are….I would just say there are many, many projects that are either in the works now or will be soon.  I think you are going to be pleased with a lot of the stuff that might be coming our way.  One of the projects that Pam didn’t mention because it’s in Vanderburgh County is our suggestion for a new interchange on I-164 at Millersburg Road.  I think that that will be a critical interchange for the movement in northern Vanderburgh County to access the interstate.  And your support on that when time comes, if they should balk at it, will be critical.  So even though it’s County you’re going to be annexing I’m sure at some point sometime.


Unknown voice


Rose Zigenfus: One or the other, yeah.  One or the other, so thank you.


President John: Thank you. Any other question for Rose?  If not I’ve got just a couple of quick matters.  With the last change of Administration I think the Mayor left this Administration in real good shape as far as any carry forward bills and unpaid invoices, or at least they were covered by incumbents as if they were.  And I would encourage the current Department Heads to treat the new Administration the same way.  It always gets you started a step behind if you walk in and find out that there are a lot of bills that are unpaid that have to be paid that have to be paid out of your operating balance, or budget for that year.  So I would hope that the Department Heads, and I’m doing this just so it’s on public record, we’ll abide by the law and not spend money that hadn’t been appropriated for those particular expenditures.  Second I noticed that there seems to be some dialog right now about the 8 ½ million dollars in the Capital Development Fund.  That was an issue in the last election and I know that the Committee that’s been looking at this has put a lot of time and a lot of effort into reviewing all the applications for the use of those funds.  I’ve noticed that there is a request by the incoming administration that any action on those allocations be stopped until the beginning of the year to give them a chance to not only review the allocation of those funds, but the procedures that are being used, the safeguards that are being put in place, 

the accounting of those particular funds, and I would encourage the Redevelopment Commission


to kind of hold off on those particular allotments until the new Administration has had an opportunity to review those.  And I would like for a letter from this Council since we have two appointments to go forward to the Redevelopment Commission asking that they hold off, not to eliminate the distribution, but to hold off to at least allow the new Administration an opportunity to review them before we spend 8 ½ million dollars.


Councilman Kniese: Are you talking about the Redevelopment Commission or the Capital Development Advisory Committee?


President John: Well the Advisory Committee can’t spend the money.   It’s the Redevelopment Commission right?


Councilman Kniese: It’s the Capital Development Advisory Committee that’s actually done all the work reviewing on all the proposals….


President John: That’s correct.


Councilman Kniese: … and the recommendation date is supposed to be the 19th, I believe, of this month.  With the Redevelopment Commission has not as far as I understand has not set a date as far as whether they are going to hear those recommendations.  I believe the 2nd or 3rd of December is their first meeting date in the month of December following the recommendation date.


President John: Well my request would be that a letter go to the Redevelopment Commission who is the authority that has the right to distribute those funds and expend them, that they hold off until the new Administration has had an opportunity to review not only the request, but the procedures that have been set up for the distribution.  Yes.


Councilman Melcher: I also know that Aztar has to approve everything.  Where do they fall in Jeff?  Do they fall in with you, or do they fall in before the Redevelopment, or do they fall in after the Redevelopment?


Councilman Kniese: My guess is, and I’m not on the Redevelopment Commission, my guess is they would be talking with the Redevelopment Commission who has, as Curt said, has the ultimate, I guess authority to …


President John: Well they have the semi ultimate.  It has to be in agreement with the Aztar officials, but I’m sure Aztar doesn’t want to step up and be the bad guy and say: “we are not going to approve anything”.  I would like it to be initiated from this side given the size of the amount of money that we are looking at distributing.


Councilman Kniese: What you recommend though is to the Redevelopment Commission not to the Capital Development Advisory Committee.


President John: Not to the Capital Development, and I do compliment all the members of that for putting in the time and effort to review all these, but before those expenditures are made, I would like to have the new Administration at least have an opportunity to see how those are going to be spent. 


Councilman Angermeier: Mr. Chairman do you want that in a form of a motion?


President John: I’d like it in the form of a motion to send a letter to the Redevelopment Commission to that effect.


Councilman Angermeier: I move in compliance to the wishes of the Chair.


Councilman Bagbey: Second.


President John: Can we have a motion that a letter go forward.  And I will assist the Clerk in drafting it, and seconded by Councilman Bagbey.


A motion by Councilman Angermeier seconded by Councilman Bagbey that an informal letter be drafted and go forward to the Redevelopment Committee to hold all expenditures until the new Administration has a chance to review it.  Voice vote.  So ordered.


Councilman Kiefer: Can we…will you bring that letter back for the Council to bid a review the letter.  Or are you sending it out….


President John: You know time is of the essence this is the 17th and the recommendation is going to be made on the 19th and I don’t know.  But I can tell you in essence what it will say is that we are requesting that they hold off any allocation of funds until the new Administration has had an opportunity to review the procedures and the requests before any distributions are made.


Councilman Kiefer: Okay.  So they might review it prior to the Commissioners meeting in December then.


President John: Well I would assume that they are going to review any recommendations that come forward from the Capital Development Board.


Councilman Kniese: My guess is after the November 19th meeting that’s when they would….


President John: Right.


Councilman Kniese: Want to make their reviews.  I’d be glad to give them all thirty-five proposals if they want to look at them. (laughter)


President John: I’m not asking that we go through the whole procedure and review everything again, but I think it’s important to give the Administration the opportunity to at least review.  Since it was an issue in the election.  How far we go with this process.  How much of that money is spent.


Councilman Kniese: I just want to make sure that I’m clear that…..


President John: And one caveat to that.  I noticed that both sides have said they want to see the $300,000 that’s going to allocated for Whirlpool go forward.  So I would include that in that letter that we are not asking…..



Councilman Kniese: That’s the only project that I’m aware of that truly does have a time constraint put on it for some other matching funds.  But just make sure I’m clear, this has nothing to do with the recommendations on the 19th of November, this goes right to the Redevelopment Commission.


President John: It will go to the Redevelopment Commission.


Councilman Kniese: Thanks.


Councilman Melcher: The only thing I will agree with my colleague to the right of me.  He said while we were running that, you know, when the City’s got a lot of free land, and, you know, we could maybe give the land instead of money.  And so since we own that property down there and I know that there is a couple of people want to build apartments down there.  Instead of giving them the land and the money, if we give them the land then we don’t have to give them that money and that frees up that money for somebody else.  So that’s where I agree, you know…at Culver when we are meeting there I agreed with him that that property down there is….so if somebody wants to build some housing we give them the land and not money too.  Because isn’t that what you said that we ought to be giving land and they could either buy the land at a real cheap price or give them the land, and that would help out.


Councilman Kniese: Well I didn’t specify which project I just said any land…..


Councilman Melcher: I know you said any land and…..


President John: I will draft a very generic letter asking basically for a delay in any action on their part until the new Administration’s had an opportunity to review it, with the exception of the $300,000.  Any other matters?  Councilwoman.


Councilwoman Walden: And then if we could just all have a copy of that in our packet that would be great.


President John: I’ll ask Alberta to get that out.  Any other matters to come before the Council this evening.  If not, we will go to Committee Reports. 





President John: The Finance Committee has a meeting set on November 17th at 6:20 on Ordinance F-2003-20. 



Nothing scheduled at this time.



G-2003-27 at 6:00.


President John: Thank you.  Any other matters to come before the Council this evening.  If not the Chair would entertain a motion to adjourn.




Councilman Watts moved and Councilman Bagbey seconded the motion to adjourn.  Voice Vote.  So Ordered.  Meeting adjourned at 7:30 p.m.











Last updated: 5/18/2007 11:40:33 AM